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Rodrik and King's LandingEdit
The Season 2 Viewer's Guide claims that Rodrik Greyjoy died leading an attack on King's Landing . This is in error. In the books he is killed attacking Seagard. This was a localized rebellion. A major point is that it only lasted until the royal fleet (stationed on the east coast of Westeros) was able to sail around to the west coast and attack the Iron Islands. The concept that the Ironborn could launch any form of seaborne attack at King's Landing is ridiculous. When I questioned Opark77 about including this, even though its probably just a simple error made by whoever is typing up the viewer's guide and not intended as a major and implausible retcon, he defended it by saying that "Seagard is a natural foothold for landing troops to get to the Crownlands from the Iron Islands being situated on the shore of Ironman's Bay."...no, marching from Seagard to King's landing would involve *traversing an entire continent* from west coast to east coast, and we *cannot* infer that an "attack on King's Landing" was implied by an attack on Seagard. You'd have to either go through the Ruby ford or past Riverrun, and either way...people would *notice* this. For that matter, as stressed in the books, the Ironborn don't favor *massive campaigns on foot across an entire continent*. They're skill is at raiding the coasts from boats.
To this end, I demand a formal vote that we disregard what is stated on this one page in the HBO viewer's guide, which has never been stated on screen, and which is assuredly simply a careless error. --The Dragon Demands 19:59, May 31, 2012 (UTC)
Agree, sometimes we gotta fill in the blanks. Besides I have faith that the Season 2 bluray will include features on House Greyjoy. --Gonzalo84 20:39, May 31, 2012 (UTC)
- I'm sorry: you mean that you "agree" that we should disregard the Viewer's Guide, or you "Agree" with the Viewer's Guide? (my fault for not comprehending)--The Dragon Demands 20:51, May 31, 2012 (UTC)
To get to King's Landing from the Iron Islands Seagard is a natural landing point. It is at the innermost part of Ironman's Bay. Landing there minimizes the overland travel distance. While its true that Seagard and King's Landing are on opposite coasts of the continent the same is true of the Iron Islands and King's Landing. To get to King's Landing from the Iron Islands you either have to go around the world or cross the continent. Seagard and King's Landing are both at the inlets of large bays so the overland distance between them is significantly less than the overland distance between Lannisport and King's Landing. As I said on The Dragon Demands talk page I think it would be stupid for the Ironborn to attempt an overland attack, however I do think the whole Greyjoy rebellion was strategically unsound so a foolish attack does not seem out of the question to me. Why did they attack Seagard in the books? Why bother to attempt to take a single well defended castle?
Ultimately, I do think the viewer's guide might be in error. However, it is the only source we have for Rodrik Greyjoy in the context of the TV show so I think we have to follow it even if it might be in error, unless a better source comes along. I hope Gonzalo84 is correct and we get a nice featurette on the history of House Greyjoy and their rebellion on the home video release of the second season. Until that time I think we go with the source we have.--Opark 77 07:41, June 1, 2012 (UTC)
Agree to disregard. The ironmen attacking King's Landing is militarily impossible, so it's clearly a mistake. They were referring to either Seagard (as in the books) or Lannisport (combining Rodrik's death with Euron and Victarion's raid on Lannisport mentioned by Tyrion in S1). I will attempt to confirm.--Werthead 16:27, June 2, 2012 (UTC)
- Additional information: HBO have told Westeros.org that this is a mistake. The Viewer's Guide will be updated at some point to reflect this.--Werthead 21:30, June 6, 2012 (UTC)
- Thanks for the update, I have altered the article to avoid mentioning King's Landing.--Opark 77 22:28, June 6, 2012 (UTC)
- I have to say that I disagree with the Ironborn attacking King's Landing being "militarily impossible." The Ironborn attacking King's Landing and winning might well be but there is a small chance that they could at least attempt an attack. They have boats and men, that is all it takes to put it in the realm of the possible.--Opark 77 22:31, June 6, 2012 (UTC)
- Indeed it isn't militarily impossible, they would need to just circumnavigate Westeros.--Gonzalo84 22:37, June 6, 2012 (UTC)
- Militarily impossible, not physically impossible. Of course they could physically circumnavigate Westeros. But sailing through the entire Royal Fleet? Including the Tyrell fleet? That's militarily impossible. Moreover, their objective wasn't to conquer the Seven Kingdoms...just quietly slip away in the hopes that Robert was having so much trouble reining in Targaryen loyalists that he wouldn't go attack them out on their islands. Attacking the *capital* of the Seven Kingdoms would go entirely against this, a big way to get noticed. But again...this has nothing to do with circumnavigating Westeros.--The Dragon Demands 01:45, June 7, 2012 (UTC)
- Well that is good news Werthead. How did they tell Westeros.org? Private e-mail? I should really work on adding everything conceivable to the "list of differences between the TV show and books" with particular focus on auxiliary materials from their website (our list of spelling errors, etc.) so we can mail in a list of questions in bulk.--The Dragon Demands 01:57, June 7, 2012 (UTC)
The infobox for this article now lists the Siege of Great Wyk and Old Wyk along with the Battle of Fair Isle. Have these been established in the context of the show? If not we should not be listing them. I'll check back in 1 week or so and delete those listings if there is no reference added.--Opark 77 12:44, June 19, 2012 (UTC)
- They mentioned that "Stannis smashed the Greyjoy fleet", but otherwise...the sieges of Old Wyk and Great Wyk haven't been even alluded to. They were pretty obscure in the books too, seems like copying from AWOIAF.--The Dragon Demands 15:49, June 19, 2012 (UTC)