Talk:Tommen Baratheon

Baratheon line is not extinct

As opposed to what this wiki states, there is still Gendry and Barra out there who are the last of the true Baratheon lineage. There are many other unknown bastards of Robert--MazenOfTheNightsWatch

...Remember when Barra died?

TV series continuity, separate from books, has also sort of implied that Gendry is the only surviving one. Yeah even Littlefinger and Varys don't know of all of them.--The Dragon Demands (talk) 20:58, February 6, 2016 (UTC)

New Family Tree image

We need a new image for Tommen on the family tree; Callum Wharry has been growing up, and as with several of the younger child characters, his face now looks very different. He hasn't appeared in Season 3 yet of course, so I'm not sure what would be a good one.--The Dragon Demands (talk) 01:05, June 10, 2013 (UTC)

Tommen recast?!?!

The shit has just hit the proverbial fan. Rumors abound that Tommen Baratheon may be recast for Season 4....using Dean-Charles Chapman, who played Tommen's first cousin Martyn Lannister in Season 3! This requires immediate attention and close attention...--The Dragon Demands (talk) 18:43, August 19, 2013 (UTC)

For what it's worth, there was a Twitter conversation between Lena Headey (Cersei) and Dean Chapman where she calls him "son." That may not mean a lot, but it seems interesting as the two actors were never on screen together before. TheUnknown285 (talk) 00:40, December 17, 2013 (UTC)

This twitter post is intriguing, thank you for posting it here.--The Dragon Demands (talk) 21:42, December 17, 2013 (UTC)

I've been looking at the Foreshadowing video they just put out looking for either Callum Wharry or Dean-Charles Chapman. I think I've found Tommen here sitting between Cersei and Tyrion. Granted, it's been like two years since we've last seen Callum Wharry and I haven't seen a recent picture of him, but that looks like Dean-Charles Chapman. TheUnknown285 (talk) 06:33, February 10, 2014 (UTC)

It was good to check the video, but it's too blurry to use as proof. As you said, Wharry was a child actor and after 2 years might just look really different.--The Dragon Demands (talk) 15:57, February 10, 2014 (UTC)

Zap2it confirms Dean-Charles Chapman is playing Tommen. They also have a picture on their Instagram at the Season 4 premiere. TheUnknown285 (talk) 00:51, March 19, 2014 (UTC)

Additionally, Chapman's former acting school posted a tweet congratulating him for landing the role of Tommen; this tweet was liked by Chapman himself and even retweeted by his mother. Also, Chapman's Twitter bio has been updated. Before, it listed "Game of Thrones" among several productions he's been in such as Billy Elliot (the role that his Twitter account is named after). Now it's just Game of Thrones that's listed. The only counter-factual we're seeing right now is the HBO website still lists Callum Wharry as playing the role, but I don't think it's been updated as I don't see any Season 4 characters (unless I completely missed them). TheUnknown285 (talk) 15:32, March 20, 2014 (UTC)

Elio and Linda on Westeros.org just put up a video discussing their general impressions of the first three episodes, and they have confirmed that Tommen was recast. So it's official.--The Dragon Demands (talk) 17:01, April 5, 2014 (UTC)

New Title

It would appear Tommen Baratheon is the new heir apparent to the titles King of the Andals and the First Men, Lord of the Seven Kingdoms, and Protector of the Realm. Hail, Tommen of the House Baratheon, First of his name, King of the Andals and the First Men, Lord of the Seven Kingdoms, and Protector of the Realm. May he be a much better king than Jeoffrey

New Title

It would appear Tommen Baratheon is the new heir apparent to the titles King of the Andals and the First Men, Lord of the Seven Kingdoms, and Protector of the Realm. Hail, Tommen of the House Baratheon, First of his name, King of the Andals and the First Men, Lord of the Seven Kingdoms, and Protector of the Realm. May he be a much better king than Jeoffrey

Please unlock

Please unlock this page so we can get to editing.  Thanks.  TheUnknown285 (talk) 09:57, April 14, 2014 (UTC)

The Youngest

Should it be mentioned that Tommen will be the youngest King to sit on the Iron Throne? He' s ~12 years old in Season 4 and the youngest king before him was Daeron I Targaryen being 14 when his father, Aegon III died. SonOfZeus1200~Peace out. 02:02, April 23, 2014 (UTC)

I think Aegon III was younger.--Gonzalo84 (talk) 05:13, April 23, 2014 (UTC)

Tommen's new in-show age

Following the recasting of Tommen Baratheon to Dean-Charles Chapman, a boy of 15 during the filming of season 4, from Callum Wharry (whom is noticeably younger, by two or three years), would it be fair to say that Tommen Baratheon is now somewhat older than 12? All the other characters were aged by two years except for Joffrey, whose age was increased by four to make the deplorable acts he does and the creepily sexual violence somewhat more palatable and believable. Going by how Dean-Charles seems 4 years older or so than the character in the book, and two years or so older than the previous actor (in addition to the cougar-esque borderline seduction Natalie Dormer's Margaery Tyrell pulled on him, which implies he's not exactly a prepubescent), should Tommen's age be listed as 14 or 15 as opposed to 12? That would be in line with Joffrey's age-up, and align him better with his actor's age. 172.14.234.181 02:45, May 31, 2014 (UTC)

They didn't increase Joffrey's age to make it more "palatable and believable" - all characters were aged up about 2 years due to sexual censorship (specifically because of Daenerys), but even so Joffrey was made four years older....probably to match the actor. Child actors can't carry drama as well and much relied on Joffrey so they casted a slightly older but better actor.

If Joffrey was 17 in Season 2, that makes him 16 in Season 1 - when in Book 1, Joffrey was 12, Myrcella 8, and Tommen only 7 years old.

Given that all child characters were aged up by 2 years, I functionally assume that Myrcella was 10 and Tommen 9 in Season 1....plus 3 years of in-TV-series time, makes Myrcella 13 in Season 4 and Tommen 12 in Season 4. Tommen was about 8 or 9 when Joffrey died in the books (the war until Joffrey's death only actually lasts about 2 years, but the TV series covered this in 3 seasons, and one season = one story year in the TV series...due to the child actors aging at a normal rate).

Now their relative ages might simply be different in the books...given that Joffrey was four years older instead of two. Nonetheless, as the youngest of three children, it is physically impossible for Tommen to be more than about two years younger than Joffrey. He couldn't be more than 14 years old in Season 1, and was probably much younger. This also means he physically cannot be more than 17 years old in Season 4.

We honestly can't tell for sure now. No, Margaery was not performing a "cougar-esque seduction of him". Much as in the books, Margaery tries to curry favor with Tommen by just being nice to him, as Cersei actually kind of ignored him as the younger son. In the books, she gets him cats to play with, in the TV series he already had Ser Pounce, but Margaery admires his cat. Same thing. Nothing about it was sexual, book or TV series.

But in all seriousness: NO, what possible, factual basis is it to determine if a character is older or not based on how they...behave? And the actor's age is meaningless: Jack Gleeson, for example, is actually about three years older than Joffrey (if Joffrey was 17 in Season 2, Gleeson was 20 years old when he filmed those scenes).

We're leaving it blank until we have confirmation. --The Dragon Demands (talk) 02:59, May 31, 2014 (UTC)

Also in teenage drama series, the actor is way older than the role their play. Bianca Lawson played a role of a 18 year old girl in "Pretty Little Liars", but Lawson is 35. My point is, the actors are often older than their roles.--Mesmermann (talk) 18:03, May 31, 2014 (UTC)

Fair enough--I will acquiesce to the points that actors often play chronologically younger characters, as well as to the general idea that the age of Tommen should stay undefined until given canon status by a showrunner, in-show mention, actor, or other informed official source. However, I DO disagree about Margaery's late-night visit--there was so much unspoken sexual tension in the air between them that it made ME uncomfortable. Perhaps I was simply reading into it too far because of Lady Olenna's very pointed tale from her younger years about her late-night seduction of her future husband, the lord of Highgarden, in a very similar manner... buuut I really couldn't say definitively either way. 172.14.234.181 09:44, June 3, 2014 (UTC) 

Tommen can't be at most 18, because the producers said that Myrcella has 14 years in Season 5, so Tommen as youngest child, will have at the most 13 years.Salvador90 (talk) 12:04, April 13, 2015 (UTC)

CERSEI'S BLACK-HAIRED BABY:

This isn't complete: "he also physically could not be more than 16, because Cersei married Robert after Robert's Rebellion ended 17 years ago (Robert wasn't his father, but Robert plausibly could have been his father, i.e. Joffrey wasn't born only four months into their marriage). Given that Tommen was the third of Cersei's three children, necessitating two pregnancies after Joffrey, Tommen physically could not have been more than 14 in Season 1, making him at most 18 years old in Season 5."

Although personally I don't believe Cersei's black-haired baby existed (I think she lied to Cat when she told that story), this Wiki takes his existence at face value. If that's the case, and assuming that Cersei got pregnant with the black-haired baby right after her marriage, it still pushes back the maximum ages of her other children by an additional year. 208.226.153.28 16:34, April 27, 2015 (UTC)

The black-haired son was real. Cersei also talked about it with Robert. I think Tommen in the show is around 14-16, nothing more or less. --Gladiatus (talk) 18:35, April 27, 2015 (UTC)

Tommen's age can't be 18

We should change his age to approx. 14-18 because we don't know his real age. He cannot be 18 while Bran is 15. --Gladiatus (talk) 15:59, May 6, 2015 (UTC)

Tommen clearly is not 18, he was 8 in Season 1, now if we want it to be any contuninity, he was refered to as an eight year old in Season 1(maybe turning 9), say that 5 years has passed, so he's 13 now. By Westeros standards that is NOT too young to wed or bed, Sansa was 14 when marrying Tyrion after all. And Cersei mentions that Tommen is not yet of age when they are talking about electing a new Hand in Season 5. 

The actor who plays Tommen does not reflect the characters real age, Jon Snow, Theon Greyjoy and Robb Stark were all 17 years old in Season 1 even though the actors themselves were in their twenties. Dean-Charles Chapman even looks a couple of years younger than what he is, which I think was intentional. 

Change the age so that this wiki gets serious again! 

79.138.32.136 17:00, May 21, 2015 (UTC) Lord Lannister

Tommen clearly is not 18, he was 8 in Season 1, now if we want it to be any contuninity, he was refered to as an eight year old in Season 1(maybe turning 9), say that 5 years has passed, so he's 13 now. By Westeros standards that is NOT too young to wed or bed, Sansa was 14 when marrying Tyrion after all. And Cersei mentions that Tommen is not yet of age when they are talking about electing a new Hand in Season 5. 

The actor who plays Tommen does not reflect the characters real age, Jon Snow, Theon Greyjoy and Robb Stark were all 17 years old in Season 1 even though the actors themselves were in their twenties. Dean-Charles Chapman even looks a couple of years younger than what he is, which I think was intentional. 

Change the age so that this wiki gets serious again! 

79.138.32.136 17:00, May 21, 2015 (UTC) Lord Lannister

I agree he can't be 18. Cersei herself says that Tommen is not yet of age, hence why she's acting as his regent.--Ser Patrek (talk) 17:07, May 21, 2015 (UTC)

I think 15 might also be somewhat of a stretch, could you change his age to maybe 13 or 14? 

79.138.32.136 12:35, May 30, 2015 (UTC) Lord Lannister

Vow of silence

At the end of the Season 5 summary, it says "Tommen later takes a holy vow of silence, swearing not to speak until all of his enemies were destroyed". Tommen never did that, Qyburn said that Gregor Clegane / Robert Strong did. 177.40.13.58 14:08, June 25, 2015 (UTC)

Age (Again)

I know this discussion has been ongoing for ages now, but I refuse to believe Tommen is 19 in Season 6. That would make him the same age as Myrcella before she died (who's always been a few years older than him). It's stated he's 8 in Season 1 making him 13(ish) in Season 6. I know he's been aged up but surely not by 11 years in the past 5/6 years. Since it's never been explicitly stated how old he is, I would say he's 15 at most - judging by the way he's written and acted (what with the high voice and everything). Again, it's really difficult to determine and everyone I've spoken to about it just sees him as a young teenager (13, 14 or 15). Until it's explicity stated in the show, I'd probably leave his true age ambiguous ... Mysterious Editor (talk) 20:50, May 13, 2016 (UTC)

It would seem that his age has now been changed. 16 seems slightly more reasonable than 19 I guess. Mysterious Editor (talk) 15:48, June 29, 2016 (UTC)

No. What does "seems" mean? You looked at him and guessed? We deal with numbers.--The Dragon Demands (talk) 02:10, July 3, 2016 (UTC)

Wow no need to get pissy about it. If you actually read what I originally said, you can clearly see that I did just just "look at him and guess", thank you very much. Mysterious Editor (talk) 13:12, July 3, 2016 (UTC)

Horrible, horrible King

Can we just take a second to talk about how bad of a king Tommen is? The decision he made to merge the Crown with the Faith was so unbelievably stupid I can't believe even someone as gullible and naive as he is couldn't see how bad of an idea that was. He just signed his own death warrant, I guarantee it. 

Shellturtleguy (talk) 22:56, May 30, 2016 (UTC)

Do you prefer his book character - the little kid who signs any document he is given, inetersted in kittens, and has no idea what's going on in King's Landing and the rest of the world? 79.181.8.42 05:48, May 31, 2016 (UTC)

He's a little kid. Easily manipulated. I don't entirely blame him. Reddyredcp (talk) 06:25, May 31, 2016 (UTC)

Well, Maggy did tell Cersei when she was a child that she would have three children and all of them were doomed. As for Tommen, he may be a sheep but I personally like watching him stick it to those parents of his for a change. Cersei and Jaime have destroyed tens of thousands of lives covering up their incest. If you ask me, they deserve all the misery in the world for what they've done. Shaneymike (talk) 15:42, May 31, 2016 (UTC)

Needs update

In view of how far the show deviated from the fourth and fifth books in respect of Tommen's character, please update (or unlock for editing) the "In the books" section. 79.181.8.42 08:08, May 31, 2016 (UTC)

Change top quote?

The current one has more to do with Tywin than Tommen. Shaneymike (talk) 17:56, July 3, 2016 (UTC)

Self-defenestration?

I think it would be better if it said "autodefenestration". —Preceding unsigned comment added by Joel134 (talk • contribs)

I've changed it. --Potsk (talk) 01:35, May 28, 2019 (UTC)

Actor says Tommen was originally going to die in battle?

Interview with Dean-Charles Chapman: https://winteriscoming.net/2022/03/28/tommen-originally-planned-die-big-battle-game-of-thrones-dean-charles-chapman/

Intriguing.--The Dragon Demands (talk) 15:20, 28 March 2022 (UTC)

Labeling for Info box images: Actor names VS Child/Adolescent/Adult VS Season 1-8

Considering the existence of a 'portrayed by' section with the actor names for characters like Myrcella Baratheon, Daario Naharis, Beric Dondarrion, and Gregor Clegane, Tommen, and of course everyone else, is it more appropriate to use the actor names as labels for each image for certain characters or would Child/Adolescent/Adult labeling be more appropriate? For Tommen and Myrcella shouldn't 'Child/Adolescent' be the appropriate labeling, considering the existence of a 'portrayed by' section to begin with as mentioned above? Eddard Stark has the Child/Adolescent/Adult labeling and his Child/Adolescent actors are both in Season 6 so the Child/Adolescent/Adult labeling is appropriate. Alicent Hightower and Rhaenyra Targaryen undergo recasting mid-season so Adolescent/Adult is appropriate. Gregor Clegane has had multiple actors portrayed him and they are all mentioned in the 'portrayed by' section so should Season 1-8 labeling be more appropriate for not just Gregor but for Beric and Daario considering the 'portrayed by' section? Dragon Scholar (talk) 01:12, 29 December 2023 (UTC)